Them Crooked Vultures and a Super Group of Dudes
When I first heard that John Paul Jones, Dave Grohl, and Josh Homme were forming a band last spring, I must say that I was jealous. Are you kidding me?! These three mega-talented and unique figures playing hard rock in a unified and focused group? I was excited, to say the least, from a player's perspective AND as a fan. Then came the inevitable "supergroup" tags.
Duff McKagan's column runs every Thursday on Reverb. He writes about what's circulating through his iPod every Monday. Them Crooked Vultures play The Paramount on Saturday, November 21.
Lazy journalists like to put a tag on anything they can in an attempt to sum up a whole genre or movement with a quick phrase that will make their job easier and take a swipe at a band in the process. You know, "stoner rock," "grunge," "indie," "hair metal," etc. "Supergroup" conjures a negative image in my mind, and we in Velvet Revolver had to deal with this label in our first year. Fans never called us a supergroup, mind you, only journalists. I've heard this title being bandied about in reference to Them Crooked Vultures, and I think it is a cheap way out.
To label an act a supergroup somehow suggests--to me, anyway--that they were formed to cash in on the members' superstar power. First, when you have been playing in successful bands for a while, your friends and comrades in the field are others like you. These are simply the people that you KNOW!
And NOBODY is cashing in these days. Acts are not selling enough records to turn much profit--if any--and touring is a shrinking business. TCV is in this thing for the right reason, and that is to fucking rock.
Judging from the single, "New Fang," Them Crooked Vultures has a lot to offer a rock scene that is suffering from a lack of the real shit . . . the dirty shit! Did I mention that John Paul Jones is in the band?
John Paul Jones
For those of you who may have lived under a rock for the past 40 years, or were perhaps squirreled away in some hipster scene that disallowed such things as earth-moving grooves, John Paul Jones was the groundbreaking bass player and multi-instrumentalist in Led Zeppelin. JPJ has influenced EVERY great bass player since then, and his bass playing and sense of pocket and melody may never be matched again. To me he was the heart and soul of the band. Zeppelin lore has it that Jones held that band together and helped to make it as musical as it was, giving it a sense of depth and movement that has yet to be matched. Enough said: John Paul Jones is a bad, bad man.
Josh Homme
Josh Homme is someone who has gained a ton of respect in the community of musicians that I am acquainted with, not only for his songwriting and playing skills but as a straight-shooter and a guy who has your back if you are a friend. Josh has Seattle roots. He went to the UW while also playing in Screaming Trees in the mid-'90s before forming the stellar Queens of the Stone Age. Queens, for my money, has been the most influential band, as far as what new bands want to be and sound like, of the last eight or so years. Do I even need to add that he was a founding member of KYUSS? (FYI, everyone says they were into KYUSS when they were happening, but if it were true, the band would have been as big as U2.)
Dave Grohl
Ah, last but far from least, Dave Motherfucking Grohl. The drummer every other drummer, guitar player, and singer I know wishes they were. A songwriter whose verse and riffage flow with impossible ease and consistency. A man who is really just the nicest guy in rock and roll, who still bounces with excitement when some band or artist he likes is either passing through town or putting out a new record.
For these three guys to come together and form a real band--well, hell, it must be like some sort of fairy-dust shit just being at a band practice! Can you imagine? Them Crooked Vultures have created something new and fresh with no obvious nods to any of their past bands. A hard feat, for sure. Yes, you can tell it's JPJ on bass, Josh singing and playing guitar, and Grohl killing the drums. But the overall originality of the band's sound is startlingly refreshing. I sound like a damn rock critic right now, a breed of writer I absolutely detest. These guys are just straight-up cool and pretty fucking righteous, if you ask me.
36 comment(s)
AxlReznor says:
I really don't see people's problem with the term "supergroup" myself. The general definition is that it's a band made up of musicians that have already established themselves as members of other successful bands. Velvet Revolver definitely fit the bill, and Them Crooked Vultures having John Paul Jones and Dave Grohl I think has never made the term more appropriate.
Some of the bands who have done it in the past may have just been attempting to cash-in on their previous success, but I don't get any negative connotations, because there are plenty of other bands that have done it for the right reasons, which doesn't make them any less "super".
Some of the best examples of bona fide supergroups I can think of other than VR are Cream, Temple Of The Dog, Mad Season, A Perfect Circle, Audioslave and The Dead Weather.
As for Them Crooked Vultures themselves, I'm really looking forward to hearing their record. I hope it's not all like their single, because it sounds a bit too close to Queens Of The Stone Age for comfort to me. I love QOTSA, but I'd rather buy a QOTSA album that sounds like QOTSA, and have this project sound different. That said, it is a really cool tune, and it's great to see Dave Grohl behind the drumkit again. The Foo Fighters are awesome, and he's definitely a fantastic frontman/guitarist/songwriter, but in many way I think he's SUPPOSED to be a drummer.
Never got the whole Led Zeppelin thing, so I can't really comment on John Paul Jones, but he seems to be having fun. I hope it's a semi-permanent thing that they'll all keep coming back to, and not a one-off.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 8:03AM
katie says:
is there some rule that i'm not aware of that says when a "supergroup" is formed nowadays it must have a weirdo name?
ex.them crooked vultures,chickenfoot.
also i agree with axlreznor the single is too much like QOTSA
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 10:18AM
Daniel G. Titus says:
DOWN is the best supergroup of all time. True, the third cd was only OK, but these guys just rock and keep it real. At least Anselmo did one righteous thing with his life after destroying Pantera. Pepper Keenan is the man, and totally underrated. Check them out. The don't even have a weirdo,let's-be-special-and-quirky name!!
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 10:32AM
Peter Anthony says:
NME streaming each song
http://www.nme.com/news/them-crooked-vultures/48294
NICE!
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 11:01AM
Sophia says:
Huh, just a few weeks ago I had a discussion about someone about the term "supergroup". I feel like my mind is being read :P
I don't use the term, but I'm not really a big fan of it. I think it can put a lot of unnecessary pressure on a band. The expectations are REALLY high, and if the "supergroup" doesn't live up to these expectations, they tend to be quickly shot down. By both critics, and closed-minded fans. Take Chickenfoot for example (no comment on that name lol). Someone might want to hear Red Hot Chili Pepper influences because Chad Smith is in the band, but what they get could be totally different.
I guess I don't really like the label. But I think it's sort of inevitible if people from different bands get together.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 12:14PM
RizzRowdy says:
Same like Chickenfoot..
Don't like the term Supergroup.
But Them Crooked Vultures has put out a great rock n roll album =D
And this was fun to read :')
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 12:48PM
rjl says:
TCV also put the entire album up on Youtube to stream.
http://www.youtube.com/user/themcrookedvultures
Yeah, it's very QOTSA-flavored, but check out Reptile, Warsaw and Gunman. Esp. the choruses of he latter two.
Honestly, if I were asked to form a "supergroup" (I know...) of my favorite musicians, these guys would (do) easily top my guit/bass/drum lists.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 12:48PM
RizzRowdy says:
This was fun to read.
Don't like the term supergroup either, however Them Crooked Vultures put out a super great album ;D
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 12:50PM
Nathalia says:
Duff!! thanks for amazing show that you and the guys did here, in Brazil! really really thanks!
love you! keep rockin'
and great post, Dave Grohl is a really good singer and drummer :)
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 1:16PM
The_Broken_Spoke says:
Listening to the "Drop Kick Murphys"
I'm shipping up to Boston
and always on rotation "Elvis" … cut off al identifying labels, before they put you on the torture table
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 1:54PM
Brad William Cox says:
It may be insulting and shouldered by the artist(s) involved more than the actual fans - the people who don't like what you're doing, aren't going to like you (no matter the reason) - it's really that simple.
I can't see a fan of the band [or the musicians involved] going, "Well, it's a deal breaker - the media officially deems them a supergroup - no cred points for those guys - it's a shame, too, I really thought they had some innovative material!"
I guess you can't control what you don't have control over - it just has to play out.
Labeling is just a way of accounting - it's not reality. You either take the time to figure it out - or you don't.
I'm a father. I'm an ad sales guy. I'm a singer in a band. I'm a...whatever.
If you're my daughter/wife, I'm all of those things. If you're my boss, I'm two of those things. If you're at my concert, I'm one of those things.
It doesn't really matter.
I get what you're saying, but it's an ego-trap to dwell on it or take it personally - 'It is what it is,' as we say on the East Coast!
Some of these groups of players work and some don't. TCV seem like they'll be fine [in terms of handling the labels/press].
They aren't presenting themselves or marketing themselves to be minimized.
VR worked. The fans didn't see the band as a 'supergroup' - plus, you guys were in the position to make/change the rules - right? It's a blessing and a curse, I suppose.
And ya' know, the best way to deal with that is to go head first with a snotty journalist - "Yeah, I guess we're a supergroup - we're seasoned, we're better songwriters/players than most, and people are paying to see us...so, f@* off!"
I've read on many occaisions how you [Duff] hated the term 'supergroup' - but, it's not really a bad thing. It's a love/hate thing. Love the fact that you're in a position to be considered a guy in a band of players deemed 'supergroup'-worthy and hate the title on it's insinuation - but, don't shoulder it.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 1:57PM
Delilahsue says:
Regardless of what label they want to use TCV kicks some rock & roll ass and really, does it matter what somebody labels them?
I don't think so~!
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 2:29PM
Davis says:
Although seeing my favorite drummer hasn't been possible since 1980, I wish to see the man that held the groove with him. Unfortunately, the show in Portland is sold out and I must resort to criaglist to deal with scalpers
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 3:52PM
Billy says:
Right on is all I gotta say. I was super stoked when I heard about this band. JPJ and Grohl on drums, what a rhythm section! I have been listening to this album ALOT since they made a stream available via youtube. Josh Homme is a bad ass. KYUSS, you hit the nail right on the head, it became quite cool to know everything Kyuss after Queens got big. I am quite looking forward to having this album in the car to jam on the road.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 3:55PM
Scott says:
The great thing is that the media originally labled Led Zeppelin a "supergroup" and now of course nobody thinks of them that way...they're just Led Zeppelin.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 7:08PM
Nicolas says:
I don't much like the label supergroup myself, considering that one of my favorite bands is the Raconteurs, who quite often get the label "supergroup". VR... I don't know, I have mixed feelings about VR.
Frankly, the only "supergroup" that I can really think of is the Dirty Mac.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 7:52PM
elmo jones says:
er, just wanted to mention jpj's solo album from 2001: The Thunderthief...it's really good...really good
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 9:05PM
Mike F. says:
I've got your supergroup right here... it's a power trio...
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 9:46PM
Tingleyfeeln says:
Dave Grohl where he belongs-behind the drum kit. Not knocking Foo Fighters or Grohl as a frontman, but he is one of the best drummers of the last 20 years. In my opinion his best drumming was on the Killing Joke album he played on. Some of those beats were seriously fucking sick.
OK, I can't resist, top 10 drummers of the last 20 years, no particular order
Dave Grohl
Steven Drozd (Flaming Lips)
Stephen Perkins (Janes addiction)
Jimmy Chamberlin (Smashing Pumpkins)
Matt Cameron (Soundgarden and Pearl Jam)
Brann Dailor (Mastodon)
Dale Crover (Melvins)
Tim Alexander (Primus)
Glenn Kotche (Wilco)
Travis Barker
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 12 2009 @ 11:36PM
strapped_with_cats says:
[Yo 2 all dem black cats' word]
Ya'll know me Ill turn to them ol' G's
But I been low key, wit no cheese
Mad at me?
Got a crib wit a studio and it's all full of tracks
Who you think brought you the o' G's
Yeah that group that sand fuck the police
And niggas that said I flip floped
U the reason "acronym" don’t sleep
So fuck ya'll all of ya'll
If ya'll don't like me blow me
Ya'll are gonna keep fuckin around wit me
And turn me back to the old me
Nowadays everybody wanna talk like they got something to say
But nothin comes out when they move they lips
Just a buncha gibberish
So what do you say to somebody you hate
Or anybody trying to bring trouble your way
Wanna resolve things in a bloodier way
Just study your tape of NSA
One day I was walkin by
Wit a head on
When I caught a spic giving me a hard on
And he tried to take my finger off in a second ave lot
I don't give a fuck if he's dark or not
Cause I was drunk as fuck
Fuck you too bitch call the cops
And when the cops came through
Me and the "acronym" stood next to a burnt down house
Wit a can full of gas and a hand full of matches
And still weren't found out
And the temp goes up, callin men ladies
Sorry Doc but I been crazy
There is no way that you can save me
But she says its ok, you can go with him baby
If it was up to me
You muthafuckas would stop comin up to me
Wit your hands out lookin up to me
Like you want somethin free
Now you wanna run around and talk about guns
Like I ain't got none
What you think I sold 'em all
Cause I stay well off
Homey please tell them u don’t need cheese to "push one" from the trees
Cause this is the dayz of aftermath
And I aint haven that, in my habitat
It's like a jungle in this city crap
But all you (black cats) [acronym]
Knew that I was strapped wit gats
When you were cuddled wit cabbage patch
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 12:02AM
El Hugo says:
Really fun writing here Duff. Made me laugh...
No offense to Dave or Josh, but for me this one's mostly about seeing JPJ get out there and have some big fun.
Second the recommendation for The Thunderthief. Zooma is pretty cool too...
More recent rock & roll drummers with some of that amazing fairy-dust shit going on:
Dan Allaire (BJM/Spindrift)
Janet Weiss (Sleater Kinney/The Jicks)
Taylor Hawkins (Foo Fighters)
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 1:03AM
AxlReznor says:
I listened to the album on Youtube last night. It is a really great record, but the entire thing sounded like Queens Of The Stone Age. In fact, I think it could be the best Queens Of The Stone Age album since Songs For The Deaf. Unfortunately that's the only band I hear any influence from... I would've liked to take your word for it that there are no obvious nods to any of their previous bands, but there are. But what the hell, it's a fantastic rock record from two of rock's biggest ever talents... and a bass player who everyone seems to love merely for being in Led Zeppelin, but has never done anything to justify the hype to me (he and John Bonham are the most boring rhythm section to ever be called the best ever... and I know I'm pissing on something sacred to many people here, but it's how I feel).
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 1:46AM
Kris says:
Count me as one of the pleased about TCV. Wildly so. Love, love, love John Paul Jones (especially w/ Diamanda Galas. The Sporting Life is so worth it).
As for "supergroup"--eh, yeah, journalist shorthand. But: "And NOBODY is cashing in these days. Acts are not selling enough records to turn much profit--if any--and touring is a shrinking business. TCV is in this thing for the right reason, and that is to fucking rock." Well said.
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 6:45AM
Simone says:
Wow!
I've told you once, you write very well!
Congratulations for your text and your vision about rock n'roll.
You're a great musician!
I loved your show here in Brazil!
Kisses!!!
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 6:47AM
Ally says:
I don't think the term Supergroup is a bad thing providing it's reserved for those that really deserve it and it remains fairly exclusive. Unfortunately the phrase is now meaningless as we’re so used to the media over-hyping everything.
I'm just bracing myself for the "Supergroup with the Stars" vote in version. The mind boggles as to the lineup that could potentially transpire....
Have a great weekend everyone!
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 6:50AM
AxlReznor says:
I can't be sure that this is the reason, but it occurred to me that Duff's aversion to the term "supergroup" could have something to do with his "punk ethic"?
At the time punk hit, there were musicians all over the place forming these "supergroups", gaining an instant audience, but following up with lacklustre music. It was a time when the term could genuinely be considered a bad thing.
I do seem to remember a lot of people being highly skeptical of Velvet Revolver when they first formed... but much of this criticism was put to an end when Contraband hit, and it was actually awesome. Same with Audioslave's debut album, and all the similar groups during this decade. No matter how many times this has been done successfully in the recent past, people still expect a disaster like Billy Corgan's Zwan.
Again, I could be - and probably am - misinterpreting the situation completely. Just trying to understand why some people see it as an insult, others as a compliment, and others as just a statement of fact.
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 7:42AM
Brooke M says:
I dont really consider Josh or Dave "supergroup". JPJ, yes. You, yes.
Posted On: Friday, Nov. 13 2009 @ 9:31AM
dave says:
sad sack . Reznor and Axl are super flakes
Posted On: Saturday, Nov. 14 2009 @ 6:40AM
James says:
Thank you Duff for taking the words right out of my mouth. Im tired of reading reviews that fail to judge the Vultures on their own merits, instead they take the easy way out like you said ~lazy journalism~ and spend pages comparing them to other bands (ex: that piece of shit Rolling Stone review-I love how they give every album 3 1/2 stars no matter if its positive or negative). Speaking of RS I thought they might be cool again for about a week and have TCV on the cover but of course the Aussie edition does~ I guess we in the US aren't deserving; they'd rather have some inane naked broad or American Idol loser once again.
Ive been unable to get my Queens... albums out of heavy rotation for 5-6 months ~Josh is one of my true heroes~ and the anticipation for the TCV album has been intense. I was worried my expectations were too high but Im glad to say it live up to my wildest dreams!
Posted On: Saturday, Nov. 14 2009 @ 1:20PM
Jim Bob says:
@axlreznor--"jpj and bonham are the most boring rhythm section to be called best ever" i almost pissed my pants laughing at that chestnut. so, how's the view up there, what with your head stuck square up your a$$?
Posted On: Saturday, Nov. 14 2009 @ 2:24PM
barbarella says:
AxlReznor - you knew this will come - but, if you don't like JPJ in Led Zeppelin, just check out the number of people he produced! I've been listening yesterday to The Mission's 'Children' -one of their best.
Also, your nick is kinda 'supergroup'-ish. ;)
Posted On: Sunday, Nov. 15 2009 @ 1:23AM
AxlReznor says:
@barbarella - Was actually unaware that he was a producer too. I will check it out.
If my nick ever became a supergroup? Well... it'll be interesting. Not only the end product, but also seeing how two notorious control freaks work together. lol
Posted On: Sunday, Nov. 15 2009 @ 4:26AM
Petra, Orlando says:
Hey Duff,
Thanks for a new column this week :) Withdrawals are over LOL.
@Brad-Cox: I was going to reply similar to what you were saying about the term 'supergroup' just in different wording but it summed it up! I agree; they (media) like to put names on things and stick people in boxes - let em and ignore em!
We, your fans, don't care!!
See ya next week!
Petra
Posted On: Sunday, Nov. 15 2009 @ 5:11AM
Isorski says:
Great overview of the band. I agree the term 'supergroup' is kind of a drag. Not sure I agree it equals a cash grab but I agree it's an easy term used by journos. I think Chickenfoot is a killer band too, but the Vultures feel a bit more organic and 'real' to me - probably due to the members' former bands.
I was at the Portland show last night and it was truly epic. I posted a review on my blog at http://bit.ly/6tPcFI
Posted On: Monday, Nov. 23 2009 @ 2:39PM
dixy says:
it seems fairly obvious that "axlreznor" only makes the comments he made in order to get some sort of response from the author.
Posted On: Thursday, Nov. 26 2009 @ 5:05AM
dave says:
i suppose the question is " how successful must your individual previous bands have been in order to be considered a "supergroup " . I dig this record , that I know for certain ..
Posted On: Saturday, Nov. 28 2009 @ 11:43AM